| American Civil War Game Club (ACWGC) http://www.wargame.ch/board/acwgc/ |
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| Cadets Playing Games http://www.wargame.ch/board/acwgc/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=17189 |
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| Author: | nsimms [ Mon Dec 12, 2011 1:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Cadets Playing Games |
I want to see if I got this correct. It is my understanding that cadets are not allowed to engage in club sanctioned games in the ACWGC but are restricted to their training games. That means that a cadet shouldn't be asking for a game, that someone should be stopping the request when a cadet does ask for one, and that members shouldn't be accepting challenges from cadets. It also means that graduation from one of the academies is really not the determinator for when a cadet can start asking for games, but it really is once he/she is no longer identified as a cadet in the DoR because otherwise this would be an unenforcable rule. |
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| Author: | Drex [ Mon Dec 12, 2011 2:34 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cadets Playing Games |
Upon perusal of the Club Rules and the Union Standing Orders, I see nothing that says a Cadet can't play a regular officer. If he plays with his instructor then it is called a manuever, is all it says. I suppose we could say that ALL games played with a Cadet should be considered Manuevers and registered as such if that is what the membership wants. I don't think we should prevent the Cadets from playing games outside their Academy training. |
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| Author: | Drex [ Mon Dec 12, 2011 7:00 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cadets Playing Games |
If a Cadet vs regular officer game can not be declared a manuever because of an existing definition then simply forbid such a game from being registered. In otherwords, it would be considered an out-of-Club game not subject to DoR registration. |
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| Author: | Ernie Sands [ Mon Dec 12, 2011 8:06 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cadets Playing Games |
There is no reason that I can find for a Cadet NOT to post for or play a game vs anyone, while still a cadet. I, personally, do not think it is a good idea and I would not encourage it. However, some cadets are very familiar with PBEM and the BG or HPS systems and are anxious to jump into the fray. I think the MAIN reason for a cadet NOT to play a game outside of his training game would be a slow down of the training game due to other game playing. |
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| Author: | Neal Hebert [ Tue Dec 13, 2011 2:26 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cadets Playing Games |
I was under the impression that graduation from the academy (including the training game) was required before becoming a member, and that official games were those between members. |
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| Author: | Ernie Sands [ Wed Dec 14, 2011 12:26 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cadets Playing Games |
Cadets are entered into the membership as fully active and allowed into the forums. AFAIK, there is only one restriction for cadets and that is in voting. |
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| Author: | nsimms [ Thu Dec 15, 2011 12:42 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cadets Playing Games |
Hmmmm! No comments from the Cabinet nor either of the schools. What Drex and Ernie are saying makes sense based upon the way that the ACWGC rules are written but is that the intent? I can remember a decade ago when cadets posting in the forums for a game were policed up real quick, thus it didn't happen often. With the interpretation being provided here, we could have cadets with a 1,000 OBD points before they graduate. As a matter of fact, that sounds like fun. How long can a cadet go without returning a training game turn before they accumulate enough demerits to warrant their dismissal even though they have outstanding games with members? I would assume that at some point they would be accepted with 15 points without graduation and assigned to an army. |
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| Author: | pierred [ Thu Dec 15, 2011 1:05 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cadets Playing Games |
Good question. I think the original idea of the Cadet was to ensure they knew what games were played, how to PBEM, and understand the rudementaries of the club then assigned to a Unit. The process now is a lot longer with a game being played and ensuring that a basic tactics knowledge is there. Teaching how to play was not the original intent and probably should not be done. Especially when you tell them what rules to use, and what house rules to use. I don't agree with this. They should be allowed to develop their likes and dislikes on their own and not be told to use made up rules from someones bias and perceptions about what is realism. When I talk to newer members about games they give a set of rules to use and have no knowledge why, only because this is what was taught to them. Most of them say the same thing using the same rules. I am sure it turns off the casual gamer who just wants to have fun with the game. I can see were some Cadet would be anxious to engage others. A game could take a long time, weeks, months, while the new guy wants to play games. A little quandary. However I do believe the intent was for a Cadet to wait till assigned to a unit before posting challenges. This is my perception only. |
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| Author: | nelmsm [ Thu Dec 15, 2011 6:16 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cadets Playing Games |
I know I advise my cadets that they aren't to challenge for games until training is complete. Sometimes in between me telling them they are done and them getting assigned to a field unit they will find a game but I don't think that lasts until they get 1,000 OBD points. |
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| Author: | Ernie Sands [ Thu Dec 15, 2011 8:00 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cadets Playing Games |
This matter could be a POSSIBLE retention point. If a cadet spends a month or more in training, he might get a little anxious to get into the main battles. Are there cadets that are dropping from sight due to an implied restriction on their gaming? Don't you think that most people that NEED training want the training and would not put themselves into a game situation they were not ready for and those that already have a grasp of the game systems want to PLAY games and would be ready to play them? And, when you think about it, what is the harm? Having a cadet graduate from training with the 30 points awarded for that and some points for completing a "regular" game? Maybe a slight jump start on the next rank? I doubt that anyone would or could accumulate many points for playing "regular" games while still in training. |
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| Author: | Neal Hebert [ Thu Dec 15, 2011 2:52 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cadets Playing Games |
I didn't have a login to the MDT until after "graduating" from VMI; prior to that we were able to post only in the VMI forum. I'm not sure when this changed, but during my tenure with VMI a request was not made for a MDT login until training was completed. |
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| Author: | Scott Ludwig [ Thu Dec 15, 2011 7:32 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cadets Playing Games |
I think that the Cadet should be evaluated for their skill set and if they are proficient quickly sent through the process. I don't think they should be forced to linger in training if they are experienced players. Process them and get them on the field. We also have games in the Club that few trainers are available for, so it is even more crucial for attracting potential members for those games to this Club, that if they have the experience, send them through. It is a waste of resources on all ends to drag things out. Or if they have to, make it a real short game, so they get the basics. I am not talking raw recruits to the games here, I am talking about gamers who are seasoned to the games should not be held up. If the concern is the 30, then do what the CCC does, offer training, if they take it, give them the 30, if they don't give them say 10 or 15..... |
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| Author: | Dwight McBride [ Thu Dec 15, 2011 8:00 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cadets Playing Games |
I think cadets should be allowed to play other games during their training. Why? Because of my own personal experience. I was trained by a person who seemingly refused to crank up any speed to the training. I was lucky if I got one turn from my trainer per week. Therefore, any proposed rules covering this issue should----in all fairness----take my experience into consideration. |
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| Author: | David Danner [ Fri Dec 16, 2011 6:34 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cadets Playing Games |
Gentlemen: I just saw this posting. Under new member orientation at the UMA this paragraph is in "Posting for a Fight" and should answer Ned's inquiry but this is new wording that will be released soon: "After you have graduated from the UMA you will be anxious to get started fighting real BATTLES against the Confederate side of the Club. How do you go about doing this you ask? You'll have to "post for a fight!" Only graduates from the two Club academies may post for a sanctioned fight!" The older version is: "Training is done under the direction of a Union Military Academy instructor. Training might be conducted through playing a game with the instructor by e-mail, or it might be done through the use of the training exercises that you can download using the links on this page. The instructor determines the best method for each Union Military Academy cadet. Upon successful completion of Union Military Academy training, a cadet is commissioned a 1st Lieutenant and is given a brigade assignment in one of the Union armies. At that point, the new officer can fully participate in all club activities." I believe both quotes make it very clear that the answer is no and that Union Cadets must graduate before making a challenge. |
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| Author: | Dwight McBride [ Fri Dec 16, 2011 9:57 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cadets Playing Games |
Well . . . that wins the argument . . . but it doesn't solve the problem. |
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