American Civil War Game Club (ACWGC)

I know that the club does not allow a player to remove units from the map for the sole purpose of avoiding a loss in VPs.

The only legit reason, that I am aware of, is for players to remove units from a predesignated exit hex.

But what about this scenario?

Since any player can view the scenario ahead of playing it and can review the entry hexes and times, it is very possible for the other player to set up a trap. And that 5 hex buffer is insufficient to guard against this legal tactic.

What are your thoughts on the following, that in the event of a trap being laid for oncoming reinforcements, that that player be allowed to withdraw from the map without penalties?

Now I know that this too could be used in a gamey way. A player may see the trap, try to overcome it, then after that fails, exits the maps.

So, I would allow the oncoming player two turns to decide to stay or leave. The oncoming turn would not count. If they arrive on turn 30, they must leave by turn 32.

Just a thought to open a conversation.

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Brigadier General Richard Walker
II Corps, 4th Division, 6th Brigade
Army of Tennessee
(JTS/WDS Scenario Designer)

I think players are free to discuss whatever they want before the game, and to agree whatever they want as a result. This would be a reasonable way to resolve this issue, in my opinion.

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Lieutenant General TW Marshall

ACWGC President 2022 - 2025

Commanding Officer, II Corps, Army of Tennessee

I would be hesitant in changing Rule 6.1.1.3:
Players who withdraw any of their forces from the battlefield map, other than via a designated Exit Hex or as specified in the scenario as a victory condition, shall suffer a two-step reduction in the level of victory.

The reason being is that every scenario is different. In small scenarios where there is a slim margin in Victory Conditions even the withdrawal of a few units could affect the outcome. Also, there are a few tactics to circumvent an ambush of reinforcements [I will not reveal them here].

The suggestion of General Marshall seems valid. If a scenario presents the likelihood of an unavoidable ambush (and massacre) the players should agree on a house rule that covers it. For example, no Union unit may be within 10 hexes of the Confederate Arrival Hex {XX,XX} before a certain time. The house rule would vary depending upon the scenario. If the players can't agree they should play another scenario.

I think house rules are advisable in many scenarios [I usually insist upon Artillery Stacking Limits and Night Move Restrictions] to hinder gamey play and unrealistic situations. Again, some would be scenario specific. An example would be Gettysburg 007. If I was to play that one I would want a house rule prohibiting any Union attack upon Second Corps' supply wagons until after their release time [Reason: for the sacrifice of a couple of suicide cavalry squads Second Corps supply would be reduced by 75%].

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Paul Swanson
Lieutenant-General
First Division
First Corps
Army of Northern Virginia

I guess I have to ask, why are club rules needed in the first place? Why not make rule 6.1.1.3 a "house rule?"

I imagine it is because people forget to ask the relevant questions and then bitch about it after the fact. Well sir, I did not know you could do that!

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Brigadier General Richard Walker
II Corps, 4th Division, 6th Brigade
Army of Tennessee
(JTS/WDS Scenario Designer)

I believe the rule was originally instituted many years ago to prevent Confederates beating up on the Yanks on the first day and then retreating off the map on the second day. There were other ways this could have been handled, such as placing objectives near the Confederate side of the map, but that would have meant changing the scenario. This was back in Talonsoft days I believe and I'm not even sure we had a scenario editor back then. I noticed the same problem in other scenarios since such as Peebles Farm. Of course, this is a different problem than that outlined by Rich. I think the best solution to the original problem is to avoid or modify scenarios where ambushes of this nature are possible.

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MG Mike Mihalik
Forrest's Cavalry Corps
AoWest/CSA