American Civil War Game Club (ACWGC)

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Lt. Gen. C. N. Matthews
Pickett's Infantry Division, I Corps,
Army of Northern Virginia, CSA

How about as a compromise having ANY night movement cause automatic disruption? ...even for units marching on roads at night. Perhaps another house rule could restrict night marches to major Pike routes only?

I've played a lot of games where I've made big night movements because it was the only way of moving in a hidden manner. It is extremely difficult to move in daylight and keep it hidden from an opponent (with the 70 hex visibility at least).

Gen. Matthews and I have just started a game which we have agreed will prohibit any night movement. This will give me a very different game experience as I just know that I would otherwise be relying on the ability to march my reinforcements up during the night. Having to stop and "sleep" for 8 hours is gonna spice things up a great deal.

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Brigadier-General Jim Wilkes.
2nd Brigade, Cavalry Division, XX Corps.
AoC. U.S.A.

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Lt. Gen. C. N. Matthews
Pickett's Infantry Division, I Corps,
Army of Northern Virginia, CSA

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General Kennon Whitehead
Chatham Grays
AoT II/1/3 (CSA)

A night time road march should accrue about 700 points of fatigue. Whatever it takes per turn to get there. We did an all night tactical cross country out at the National Training Center, about 1990, and we were still in pretty good shape come morning, but, man, the guys were grouchy! They just wanted to go kill something and then go to sleep!
J Ferry
2lt 2/20th Corps

With the new fatigue rules I found that your units would be quite fatigue at the end of an all night march. This is with the night fatigue movement rule on.
I am not sure what you guys are talking about. The penalty seems quite good as it stands. An opponent of mine did move all night and was in no shape to mount a sustained attack. He went to maximum quite quickly. He was not paying attention to it. Not only do you accumulate more fatigue but you do not recover any as well.

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Best Regards,

General Pierre D.

5th Bde, IV Cavalry Corps
Army of Northern Virginia
ACWGC President 1997 - 2006, 2012
ACWGC Forum Administrator

Pierre--
Could you please tell us what scenario that was? I have always felt that when the engine was working correctly no special rules were needed to make night moves/combat an "iffy" proposition!
John
2lt 2/20th Corps

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Lt. Gen. C. N. Matthews
Pickett's Infantry Division, I Corps,
Army of Northern Virginia, CSA

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MG Mike Mihalik
Forrest's Cavalry Corps
AoWest/CSA

I just checked the optional rules for Gettysburg, and night movement fatigue is there. Maybe it is not working, but it is there.
J Ferry
2lt, 2/20th Corps

Gen Matthews
I missed your question at first. It is definitely possible to modify fatigue levels and effects in the pdt (not the pdf) The demo Overland pdt will tell you what lines will affect fatigue.
Mike
I'd say that Culp's qualifies rather shakily as night combat. Most of it took place in the equivalent of the 4-hex visibility periods of dusk and dawn. The rebs took the lower Culp's Hill height because the Twelfth Corps had just left, except for Green's brigade, and they did that just at dusk. After dark, the old occupants came back and came under fire when they attempted to occupy the old trenches, so they just pulled back to wait for dawn, pretty much as we would do now if we accidentally ran into somebody on a night turn. At first light, the rebs attacked and just got smothered with fire. James Miller aptly describes the aftermath scene in a couple of his letters in my book.
J Ferry
2lt 2/20th Corps

Hi, John,

When I read the chapter dealing with Culp's Hill in Pfanz's book on the subject, I got the impression that both fire and what I would define as melee combat (although I don't think it came to hand to hand, although it did so on Cemetery Hill) was conducted after dark. I will read that part again when I get a chance. But I think my points stand.

One thing we tend to forget is that night turns are three times as long as a day turn, so in essence the troops are moving down the road at less than a mile an hour. I have had experience with night marching as you have, and I think that is pretty slow even for night marching. Perhaps some rest was factored into the equation.

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MG Mike Mihalik
Forrest's Cavalry Corps
AoWest/CSA

Even Stonewall Jackson, hard driver that he was, marched his men for 50 minutes and let them rest for ten. Instead of Harry Pfanz (I love his stuff, especially the 2nd Day book) I have an eyewitness--two actually--from the 111th Pa. Col George Cobham, in command of the brigade, and Pvt James Miller.
J. Ferry
2lt 2/20th Corps